The Journal of the Debates in the Convention which framed the Constitution of USA Volume II Part 35

The Journal of the Debates in the Convention which framed the Constitution of USA Volume II Part 35

M^r d.i.c.kenson wished the clause to be confined to the States which had not themselves prohibited the importation of slaves, and for that purpose moved to amend the clause so as to read "The importation of slaves into such of the States as shall permit the same shall not be prohibited by the Legislature of the U. S. until the year 1808"--which was disagreed to nem: con:[42]

[42] In the printed Journals, Con^t Virg^a & Georgia voted in the affirmative.--Madison's Note.

The first part of the report was then agreed to, amended as follows.

"The migration or importation of such persons as the several States now existing shall think proper to admit, shall not be prohibited by the Legislature prior to the year 1808."

N. H. Mas. Con. M^d N. C. S. C. Geo: ay. N. J. P^a Del.

Virg^a no.

M^r Baldwin in order to restrain & more explicitly define "the average duty" moved to strike out of the 2^d part the words "average of the duties laid on imports" and insert "common impost on articles not enumerated" which was agreed to nem: cont:

M^r Sherman was ag^{st} this 2^d part, as acknowledging men to be property, by taxing them as such under the character of slaves.

M^r King & M^r Langdon considered this as the price of the 1^{st} part.

Gen^l Pinkney admitted that it was so.

Col. Mason. Not to tax, will be equivalent to a bounty on the importation of slaves.

M^r Ghorum thought that M^r Sherman should consider the duty, not as implying that slaves are property, but as a discouragement to the importation of them.

M^r Gov^r Morris remarked that as the clause now stands it implies that the Legislature may tax freemen imported.

M^r Sherman in answer to M^r Ghorum observed that the smallness of the duty shewed revenue to be the object, not the discouragement of the importation.

M^r Madison thought it wrong to admit in the Const.i.tution the idea that there could be property in men. The reason of duties did not hold, as slaves are not like merchandize, consumed, &c.

Col. Mason (in answ^r to Gov^r Morris) the provision as it stands was necessary for the case of convicts in order to prevent the introduction of them.

It was finally agreed nem. contrad: to make the clause read "but a tax or duty may be imposed on such importation not exceeding ten dollars for each person," and then the 2^d part as amended was agreed to.

Sect 5. art. VII was agreed to nem: con: as reported.

Sect. 6. art. VII. in the Report, was postponed.

On motion of M^r Madison 2^{ded} by M^r Gov^r Morris Article VIII was reconsidered and after the words "all treaties made," were inserted nem: con: the words "or which shall be made." This insertion was meant to obviate all doubt concerning the force of treaties preexisting, by making the words "all treaties made" to refer to them, as the words inserted would refer to future treaties.

M^r Carrol and M^r L. Martin expressed their apprehensions, and the probable apprehensions of their const.i.tuents, that under the power of regulating trade the General Legislature, might favor the ports of particular States, by requiring vessels destined to or from other States to enter & clear thereat, as vessels belonging or bound to Baltimore, to enter & clear at Norfolk &c. They moved the following proposition

"The Legislature of the U. S. shall not oblige vessels belonging to citizens thereof, or to foreigners, to enter or pay duties or imposts in any other State than in that to which they may be bound, or to clear out in any other than the State in which their cargoes may be laden on board; nor shall any privilege or immunity be granted to any vessel on entering or clearing out, or paying duties or imposts in one State in preference to another."

M^r Ghorum thought such a precaution unnecessary; & that the revenue might be defeated, if vessels could run up long rivers, through the jurisdiction of different States without being required to enter, with the opportunity of landing & selling their cargoes by the way.

M^r M^cHenry & Gen^l Pinkney made the following propositions

"Should it be judged expedient by the Legislature of the U. S.

that one or more port for collecting duties or imposts other than those ports of entrance & clearance already established by the respective States, should be established, the Legislature of the U. S. shall signify the same to the Executives of the respective States, ascertaining the number of such ports judged necessary; to be laid by the said Executives before the Legislatures of the States at their next session; and the Legislature of the U. S. shall not have the power of fixing or establishing the particular ports for collecting duties or imposts in any State, except the Legislature of such State shall neglect to fix and establish the same during their first session to be held after such notification by the Legislature of the U.

S. to the Executive of such State."

"All duties imposts & excises, prohibitions or restraints laid or made by the Legislature of the U. S. shall be uniform & equal throughout the U. S."

These several propositions were referred nem: con: to a committee composed of a member from each State. The committee appointed by ballot were M^r Langdon, M^r Ghorum, M^r Sherman, M^r Dayton, M^r Fitzimmons, M^r Read, M^r Carrol, M^r Mason, M^r Williamson, M^r Butler, M^r Few.

On the question now taken on M^r d.i.c.kinson's motion of yesterday, allowing appointments to offices, to be referred by the Gen^l Legislature to the Executives of the several States as a further amendment to sect. 2. art. X, the votes were

N. H. no. Mas. no. C^t ay. P^a no. Del. no. M^d divided. V^a ay.

N. C. no. S. C. no. Geo. ay.

In amendment of the same section, "other public Ministers" were inserted after "amba.s.sadors."

M^r Gov^r Morris moved to strike out of the section--"and may correspond with the supreme Executives of the several States" as unnecessary and implying that he could not correspond with others. M^r Broome 2^{ded} him.

On the question

N. H. ay. Mas. ay. C^t ay. P^a ay. Del. ay. M^d no. V^a ay.

N. C. ay. S. C. ay. Geo. ay.

"Shall receive amba.s.sadors & other public Ministers," agreed to, nem.

con.

M^r Sherman moved to amend the "power to grant reprieves & pardon" so as to read "to grant reprieves until the ensuing session of the Senate, and pardons with consent of the Senate."

On the question

N. H. no. Mas. no. C^t ay. P^a no. M^d no. V^a no. N. C. no.

S. C. no. Geo. no.

"except in cases of impeachment" inserted nem. con: after "pardon."

On the question to agree to--"but his pardon shall not be pleadable in bar"

N. H. ay. Mas. no. C^t no. P^a no. Del. no. M^d ay. V^a no.

N. C. ay. S. C. ay. Geo. no.

Adjourned.

MONDAY AUG^{ST} 27^{TH}. 1787. IN CONVENTION

Art X. Sect 2. being resumed,

M^r L. Martin moved to insert the words "after conviction" after the words "reprieves and pardons."

M^r Wilson objected that pardon before conviction might be necessary in order to obtain the testimony of accomplices. He stated the case of forgeries in which this might particularly happen.--M^r L. Martin withdrew his motion.

M^r Sherman moved to amend the clause giving the Executive the command of the Militia, so as to read "and of the Militia of the several States, _when called into the actual service of the U. S._" and on the Question